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As I've remarked before, I avoid plunging into the depths of despair by remembering that few, if any, of our political and cultural battles are new. Most of them we've been fighting for a very long time, indeed.
Do we fight the Islamic Fundamentalists with tooth and nail, or do we try to "understand" our enemies, negotiate with them, sweet-talk them over to our side? That's a pretty big issue we're squabbling over right now. Various factions of Western civilization have been doing so for at least the past 60 years now.
Here's Noel Coward, mocking those who thought we should "play nice" with the WWII-era Germans (he calls them "excessive humanitarians" -- what a perfect name!).
The conservative movement desperately needs to build-up its own camp of like-minded comedians, writers, and parodists. I don't think we'll see the likes of Noel Coward again, but we need more of his modern-day equivalents.
Amen
Pat, I couldn't agree more. Today under President Obama we hit two militant bases in Pakistan. Meanwhile, doctors are reporting injuries to women and children inflicted by Hamas on those Gazans they "suspect” of helping Israel. Not much from the world over the re-arming, the use of children as human shields or the staging of attacks from hospitals, mosques etc. by Hamas. We don't hear much about murder in Sudan, abuse to children and women in Iran/Pakistan, students beaten in Caracas for opposing Hugo. We hear little about lawyers murdered in Russia, Jewish temples desecrated in France, girls doused with acid in Pakistan. Blowback is a bad thing and I wish Bush did more to explain why we must act, why like Jefferson said, we must guard the approaches of our markets and promote Liberal Democracy.
Who will battle those who hate our values, our markets, our culture? (note the demand for Islamic "people" to live under Sharia law wherever they reside) Will we wait until WMD come without signatures? Do radioactive clouds know of borders? Do pathogens know one people from another?
I was struck by what little defense of our ideals Obama put forward before he threatened our enemies. I have heard more coherent thoughts of late from the Dali Lama. We, as a nation, need to stop blaming ourselves as the prime global threat and start standing up before the gains other past Americans fought for are lost to the sands of time. Maybe now that Bush is gone we will stop cursing the last administration and realize we are still this planet’s greatest force for good. In the days to come, we shall see what backbone Obama and Clinton have. Unfortunately too many Americans refuse to see reality. Media filters the grim slide the world is taking. We are fast becoming Alfred E. Neumans concerned more about cable TV and rising healthcare costs than the slaughter of innocents and the lethal spread of facism, terror and greed.
I can see where that is going to end. Change means little if we don’t make an effort to restore pride, achievement, strength and certainty. Circumspection must become resolve.
Not the best example
Actually, the post-war niceness to the Germans was immensely successful, unlike the punitive attitudes following the First World War. There's nothing wrong with wooing a former enemy to make a friend and ally of them. On the other hand, excessive niceness to the Nazis pretty well set the stage for the Second World War in the first place.
There's a time and place for everything. Turning a blind eye to tyranny is wrong. Showing magnanimity to a thoroughly defeated foe and helping them into a new paradigm is usually not only wise, but successful.
Point noted, so when we
Point noted, so when we defeat terrorists and thwart our adversaries I will be most magnanimous. Until then we had better wake up and smell the coffee....
Written during the war years...
Hey, Janet! Always delightful to see you!
Your general point is certainly correct, but the example remains a good one. Coward notes at the beginning that it was written "during the war years." The Wikipedia article on it is quite bereft of detail, but also indicates that this was a war-time song, not a post-war song.
I haven't looked in awhile, but I recall that many speculate that had the victorious WWI countries not imposed such harsh penalties on Germany for that war, the Nazis may not have arisen. Of course, even if that's true, it doesn't mean that some other evil wouldn't have arisen instead...
Appeasement is not magnanimity
Hi Pat,
Thanks for allowing me some bandwidth lately...
A casual link between allied retribution towards Germany after WW1 and Hitlerian Eugenics? As far as humorous GOP subject matter, who were the last to leave the WH the night of the Grand Balls. Durbin, Oprah?
Media controls much of the venue for entertainers and moguls are largely Liberal. Liberal Colbert personifies the conservative dilemma by being such a huge success as a parody of a conservative pundit.
Obama was able to take the high ground from the GOP (and even Hillary)by joining the Liberal assault on Gitmo and the repeated characterizations that Bush and company were dangerous and destroying the fabric of Liberal Democracy.
Want humor? Could this be any funnier? Common Dreams even suggests our detentions MAKE suspected terrorists want to terrorize us. The NYT above shows the conservative comedic counter. Maybe we could rotate the detainees all over the country so no city becomes a target……..SNL? Fox needs a comedy channel, but instead they took MADtv off the air. Rush is not funny…..
When Stewart recently played a long series of Obama quotes and then similar Bush quotes, the audience didn't find it funny. He said his job was to point things out. Still, the time is coming for conservatives, Independents and even conscious Liberals to take aim at ALL that is wrong or sadly funny. Or in the words of an infamous Iraqi, the shoe is now on the other's foot.
And of course, conservatives need to find their funny bones. Perhaps the Democrats might help them out. After all Blago says impeachment isn't Constitutional so he might not show up...LOL
The next 4 years will be an eye-opener for Stewart
I have high hopes for Jon Stewart, Max. While plenty of conservatives dislike him, I've found that he has a solid, pretty fair head on his shoulders. His delightful cut-down of Tucker Carlson a few years ago was perfect, and demonstrated his realization of the proper role of comedy versus hard news in our political process.
He has up to now been pretty liberal, of course. But he's shown inklings of being aware of just how damaging the group-think of the Hollywood crowd can be to our society. With 4 years of reporters sucking up to Obama (they won't for that long, but it's going to take another year or so to really sink in), I think he might become a leader in getting Hollywood to display some more intellectual diversity.
I hope you are right....
I'm still smarting over the way Jon and Colbert trashed Hillary and refused to hold media accountable for some terrible bias. I didn't see any Caroline "you know" jokes and a whole lot of trash Palin jabs. Jon did take MSNBC to task. His best moments were during the writers strike when he spoke more from his heart than his writer's head.
I have some hopes as well. Everything seems a cycle and Obama will find how easily media and entertainment can turn on him. Politically incorrect comes full circle and there isn't a Bush around anymore to kick.
Thanks again for allowing me my rants and I'm sure Raf and myself will continue to stand for our Liberal minority.
Listening to the lyrics, I
Listening to the lyrics, I thought it was a post-war song. The policy of appeasement was indeed morally and practically bankrupt. There is a place for muscled value judgments. Had they been made in 1936, the whole thing could have been nipped in the bud. But the leaders were still traumatized from the Great War, and more than reluctant to embark on another war, thereby ensuring they would. But their post-war policy was remarkably successful, in both Japan and Germany. Important lessons to be learned there.
I agree with your sentiment wholeheartedly Pat, save one
correction. I never thought it was exclusively conservative to be unwavering in support of civilization against barbarism. Seems to me that's a pretty liberal notion, standing up for liberalism (in the broad sense). I've always thought of muself as a pro-defense liberal. Back in the day, that wasn't seen as much of a contradiction, as it's seen by certain people today.
Absolutely Right Raf
I am not a conservative, so why do we both agree with Pat's sentiments? Must be that what Pat highlighted is not an exclusively conservative notion, though you must admit, "we" are in our side's minority.
its the "if you're for it,
its the "if you're for it, then I'm against it" phenomenom.
Quite right, Rafique...
Didn't mean to suggest that only conservatives are unwavering in support of civilization against barbarism (though as Maxtrue notes, y'all are in a distinct minority on your side of the aisle at the moment). And certainly not all conservatives do so. On our side, we have the isolationists who think that America is capable of surviving as a free country even if the entire rest of the world succumbs to tyranny (that's the Pat Buchanan wing of the GOP). But we've managed to keep them out of power for awhile now.
Yeah, being a muscular liberal these days is to be lonely (just
ask Joe Lieberman), although not as lonely as some think. I guess the best we can hope for is for sensible hawkish types, even if there dovish (ie: Obama), until the SCoop Jackson revival takes place.
FWIW, I think Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand looks promising.
Agreed
Yep, like I said, Patterson is thinking re-election though Bloomie isn't thrilled with Kirsten...LOL
My prediction: terror will make Obama put on a new suit.
More intellectuals at work...LOL
I agree completely and on
I agree completely and on that note I'm wondering if any of you have checked out Andrew Breitbart's "Big Hollywood" blog? He similarly points out that conservatives need to get back in the game of popular culture; during the first few days I was a bit disappointed because it seemed to be quite a bit of the usual whining from Hollywood conservatives (not that they don't have gripe, but it gets old and certainly isn't going to inspire anyone to keep reading.)
The content and contributors seem to be improving (though still a bit spotty) and I was delighted to see that they've added satirist David Burge (Iowahawk). Humor is definitely what is needed and if they keep expanding in that direction it could be a good project.
Dennis Miller
Sometimes I think Dennis Miller is doing it all alone.......
Although, with people like Wise plotting out the creationist line, the GOP sets itself up for lampooning.
Miller kinda irks me sometimes, but I still like him.
I've no real beef with his list of pinheads, although Edwards ought to be ranked higher than Hard-Headed Harry.
One of Obama's first acts...
"DEBKAfile reports that both US and Israeli intelligence are certain the arms were bound for Hamas. But according to international law, the US Navy's Combined Task Force (CTF) 151, set up last week to combat piracy, was not authorized to confiscate the cargo or stop the ship because no enforcement mechanism was yet in place.
After a few hours, therefore, the US force released the Iranian vessel and two warships escorted it out of Red Sea waters. The ship and its escort are due to enter the Suez Canal heading north Saturday night, Jan. 23, after being prevented from unloading its arms freight on the coast of Sinai or Gaza.
Tehran has so far not reacted to the incident."
Well, at least Obama did not let it unload at Gaza. If he keeps it up, the conservatives ought to have less to joke about....
The following represents the core of the Grand Bargain I have mentioned here with Brian. General Odum was a proponent of making the deal with Iran rather than the options discussed here. It is my unexpert opinion that such a deal with Iran at this moment should Obama go there, is wrong and is worthy of the comments that Pat started this thread with. Earlier I linked a comment from Common Dreams trashing the Carter Doctrine. COnsidering Zbig's relationship to Obama, we can only wonder where this all will lead to as Hamas recovers from a tough beating and Hizb'Allah sets up more advanced missles.
Obama strikes Pakistan.
The guy Obama told to resign strikes back
NYT now questions Obama's Afghanistan policy Wonder why they didn't during the campaign....
Iran
Having blasted Obama's overtures, Iran has given Hamas advanced missiles AND told them to use them. Hizb'Allah has been given thousands. Gates has warned of Quds setting up shop in Latin America with Russian help.
It is clear that Iran is hoping to make a Grand Bargain with Obama on their terms based on a position of strength. Many experts here have argued that WE should negotiate from a position of strength. Hillary said the same thing and Obama called her a Republican Lite.
I am waiting for Obama to counter the Iranian claim that he is "talking" to Iran because the US position has collapsed. Hhmmm.
Israel smacked Hamas, the Iranian arms ship is being searched, Iraq just held a free election and the EU is waiting on the US for a fourth wave of sanctions as low oil prices have hurt Iran.
The record starts now on Obama's Middle East foreign policy. Expect Mitchell to return having struck out.