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A machiavellian thought about the U.S. Attorney scandal

Submitted by Simon on Wed, 03/14/2007 - 10:13am

The political valence of a scandal doesn't turn on the truth of a story. It's well and good to factually debunk the U.S. Attorneys story, but what's on the cards for the scandal?

A commenter at another blog observed: "This scandal feels, to me, just like Foley's. Republicans with heads in the sand are denying that anything untoward happened, but the public sees it for the corruption that it is." I think that's basically right - to see Foleygate as the lens to view this scandal through.

The political valence of the Foley scandal was entirely disconnected from what actually did or didn't happen. That scandal punched above its weight because it didn't punch for for itself, but for a generally-felt presupposition that the public had developed about Congress. It became a focal point for, a demonstration of, a face on a previously diffuse public disgust at Congressional lethargy and corruption. In effect: Foley became a shorthand for how public felt generally about the recent Republican-controlled Congresses.

Similarly, with Katrina: the political valence of what the federal government did and didn't do was entirely disconnected from what it actually did, didn't, should or should not have done. That scandal, too, punched above its weight because it became a focal point for, a demonstration of, a face on, a heckuva soundbite of a generally-felt presupposition that the public had developed about the Bush administration: the incompetance, the cronyism, the complete incapacity to communicate. In effect: Katrina became a shorthand for how public felt generally about the Bush administration.

And now the U.S. Attorneys scandal. Like Foley and Katrina, the political valence of this "scandal" comes not from its facts, but the way it fits perfectly into the conventional narrative of the Bush administration: obsessed with power and partisanship, the incompetance, the cronyism, the complete incapacity to communicate. It simply isn't relevant to debate it on the merits, because the truth of the matter will be lost in the din. In effect: Like the Libby jurors, the public are going to react to this information just as they did with Foley and Katrina - in terms of their existing presuppositions and projudices about the Bush administration. The scandal isn't about facts, but feelings: it's about a story that resonates with (and seems to confirm) what they already knew deep down. If this theory is correct, it's already too late to stop the scandal, and futile to combat it with facts about this particular story: the argument that must be rebutted is the entire public perception of the Bush administration that this story is being taken to confirm, not the individual facts of this story.

The goal for the democrats is to make "the U.S. attorneys scandal" a shorthand for how public feels generally about the Bush administration, and to capitalize on it electorally.

Added: In response to comments below and at Althouse, I want to clarify the point I'm making here. I'm not addressing the merits of whether there actually is or isn't a scandal here, and in discussing Katrina, I mean neither to defend nor castigate the Federal government response. Ironically enough, the point I'm trying to make is the complete opposite: that the ability of political partisans to weaponize a given story depends far less on the actual facts of the story than it does on the extent to which the story can be made to resonate with the existing preconceptions of the electorate.

In the case of Katrina, the existing public perception of the Bush administration's capacity to manage events was already pretty low, and so any story that seemed to confirm that view would punch at a far greater weight than it would have done if the administration was widely regarded as solid and competant. Put another way, the Federal government could have performed just as badly in Katrina - or, in fact, even worse - and yet it could still come out looking much better if the public perception of the Bush administration going in had been better. Public perception is an exponent: improving public perception of the administration would have had a far greater effect on post facto public perceptions of the administration's handling of Katrina than a comensurate improvement of the actual performance would have had.

Likewise, in this "scandal," Bush could have fired these attorneys without it raising an eyebrown, if doing do could not easily be portrayed in a way that confirms public opinion about the way in which it operates. The valence of the story (so I'm suggesting) comes from the fact that the public was ready to hear this story, not from the story itself.

Post facto:
Developing an idea (4/21/07)

That's what they're trying to do...

That's what politicians generally try to do. Part of the problem, as one of our new commenters yesterday pointed out, is that this White House has not been very adept at getting the real facts out. In part, this is because they've sometimes focused too much on "message" rather than "facts," and in part it's because (as Tully has often noted), the media just doesn't report the facts which they are provided by the White House.

I'm working on a general piece on the fired U.S. Attorneys myself, looking at the factual background and historical practices. But I've got to do some paying work for a bit today, so it might not make it out until tomorrow.

I do think these battles, futile though they may feel, are important, and that it is important to continue to present the actual facts regardless of how lost they seem to be getting in the debate. The regular, repeat commenters we see talking past each other are not the target audience. When I argue with folks like glasnost over at Obsidian Wings, I'm only very partially trying to convince him. The real target of my persuasion is the silent readers who don't chime in but are following along. They are the ones who haven't made their mind up, and they, the great unwashed masses, will eventually, over time and in the end, recognize the truth and act upon it, no matter what the headlines say from day to day... but only if we keep pointing out the truth somewhere for them to hear.

I'm not following why this

I'm not following why this scandal is being viewed by people more on facts than on feeling, or how it is similar to the Foley scandal. The evidence is mounting daily that the US Attorney firings were politically motivated and directed from the White House because US Attorneys would not go after Democrats (and that Gonzales may have lied about it). If true, that's a pretty serious mis-use of authority (even if legal). It is true that this does fit in well with the storyline anti-Bushers have about the Administration being generally corrupt or generally incompetent, but that doesn't mean the actual scandal isn't real or serious, or that the actual storyline isn't true.

Justin, what do you consider that mounting evidence to be?

I'm working on a larger post, but it is the proper discretion of the President and the Attorney General to exercise general prosecutorial discretion about the priorities and goals of the Department of Justice. Certainly that discretion should not be exercised to say "investigate Democrats, not Republicans" but I'm not aware of any credible particular evidence that that was the problem. What I'm hearing is that in some part the firings were over a general refusal to investigate claims of voter fraud and disagreements over the death penalty, among other things. If the Administration wants to make investigation of voter fraud a priority, and the U.S. Attorney drags his or her heels and avoids following that policy directive, that is very legitimate grounds for replacement. If US DOJ policy is to seek the death penalty in appropriate cases, and a U.S. Attorney fails to do so, that is also solid grounds for replacement.

I'm not following why this

I'm not following why this scandal is being viewed by people more on facts than on feeling

Note blog title. I could feel that someone was a modern anti-Christ, but that doesn't make them one. That the Dems hate Bush does not automatically make anything the Bush admin does a scandal. Capisce?

The evidence is mounting daily

Well, no. The political histrionics is mounting daily. That's not evidence, it's noise. That a political appointment or a dismissal/resignation from same may be politically motivated is as big a "So What?" as it gets, like being shocked to find gambling going on at Rick's while the runner is bringing you your winnings. The question isn't "Is it political?" The question is "Was the removal of the USA's criminal or majorly unethical, and if so, why and how?"

As indicated elsewhere here, to me that means "Were the USA's involved instructed to pursue the innocent or ignore the guilty? Were they dismissed for not doing so?" If not, no BFD, no scandal. Period. Patronage appointees lost their patronage, and they should quit their brattish whining. Heat, kitchen. Don't like the rules, don't play the game.

If they were instructed to harrass the innocent or ignore the guilty (or did so on their own) THEN there's scandal. Otherwise, it's just the usual wing histrionics.

Well, just because you

Well, just because you "feel" something doesn't make it not true either. I'm not sure what your point is.

Honestly, to say that there is not mounting evidence that the firings were politically motivated shows that you are either incredibly naive or willfully ignorant. The mounting evidence doesn't make the allegation true, but to dismiss the charges as crazy leftist charges or whatever is just incorrect. And, yes, the charges happen to fit in nicely with previous criticisms of the Bush administration (and that makes these charges bogus how?)

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2003615329_mckay13m.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/13/washington/13attorneys.html?hp=&pagewanted=all

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/01/AR2007030102263.html

From the top...

Honestly, to say that there is not mounting evidence that the firings were politically motivated shows that you are either incredibly naive or willfully ignorant.

First off, cut the ad hominem. You're in the wrong place for it. That I disagree with you does not call for insults. I have not dismissed the charges, I simply haven't heard any relevant ones supported by any actual evidence of actual wrongdoing, as compared to much noisy political Sturm und Drang. Was politics involved? Yep. Politics is involved in every single political patronage appointment, and every dismissal from same. That's not a scandal, it's the way the game works in a patronage system. Our patronage system was instituted in 1789, then greatly reinforced by Andrew Jackson in his first admin. A hundred and seventy five years of tradition to deplore there.

Tell me, Justin, when you last voted, was your vote politically motivated? Yes? The horror! The scandal! (Yes, that's sarcasm.)

So digest this: USA's serve at the pleasure of the president, and the president can dismiss them for any or no reason at any time. He does not need "cause" and it's not a scandal to exercise said powers, anymore than it's a scandal that we can exercise free speech and vote for whom we wish during elections. That's ANY or NO reason. He doesn't like their face. He has someone else he wants in that job. They smell funny. Their spouses belch in public. They wear the wrong color ties. Their office workers think they're mean. They keep the wrong kind of dogs for pets. ANY or NO reason--it's a privilege of the office.

Your first link: The only thing resembling "evidence" in that article is that the USA in question says clearly and unequivocally that he NEVER received ANY orders from above to pursue the vote-fraud issue, which he did not pursue because (by his account) he found no tangible and compelling evidence. He does not say he EVER received any orders to ignore a case for which he did have evidence. END OF STORY. Past that, it's partisan windbaggery.

Your second link: Zero evidence of anything remotely criminal, just a whole lot more political posturing and windbaggery.

Your third link: I'm gonna give you a break on the third link. In the interests of comity I'll pass on tossing ad hominem back at you, and assume it was a cut & paste error on your part, that you didn't REALLY mean to link to an article on Nazi propagandist Leni Riefenstahl*.

Why not try answering Pat's question first, and delineate the issue as you see it? Namely, what do you consider that "mounting evidence" to be? What crime or sin do you think is being shown, and on what grounds? Be specific.

[*--If you DID mean to do it, please excuse yourself forever from this forum.]

I'm gonna give you a break

I'm gonna give you a break on the third link. In the interests of comity I'll pass on tossing ad hominem back at you, and assume it was a cut & paste error on your part, that you didn't REALLY mean to link to an article on Nazi propagandist Leni Riefenstahl*.

Doh (to quote Homer Simpson), here is the article I meant to link to:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/12/AR2007031201818.html

I don't think (and didn't say) that there is any evidence that the firings were illegal, as the President can fire US Attorneys at will. And

Why not try answering Pat's question first, and delineate the issue as you see it? Namely, what do you consider that "mounting evidence" to be? What crime or sin do you think is being shown, and on what grounds? Be specific.

Here is another article:
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-usattys11mar11,0,7710688,full.story?coll=la-home-headlines

and

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/06/AR2007030600606_pf.html

If you want me to summarize the article, I guess I could do that, but that seems redundant. I normally hate discussing by printing links to blogs--but here it is easier to outsource what I would say (just summarizing articles):

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/013019.php

http://obsidianwings.blogs.com/obsidian_wings/2007/03/us_attorneys_th.html#more

The point is that there are serious, credible, allegations that US Attorneys were fired for not going after Democrats hard enough, or for aggressively prosecuting Republicans (specifically , Duke Cunningham). It turns out that despite earlier Admnistration statements, the firings did come from the White House etc. etc. These activities are arguably not illegal, but, if true, they are certainly unethical and a serious abuse of power that has been kept in check by the norms of Washington.

So, serious, credible allegations are made about an abuse of power, and somehow it's a raging BDS argument to seriously question and investigate the Administration on the issue? It's somehow a wild left wing delusion not to take this Administration at its word?

I didn't think you meant to

I didn't think you meant to Godwin us, but golly gee....

I disagree as to "serious and credible." The key word you use there is "allegations." Allegations aren't evidence. I can allege you've committed (insert heinous crime) but that doesn't make the allegation either serious OR credible. That requires evidence. You've already conceded no apparent criminality, so let's look at evidence of impropriety, shall we?

First link: Adds up to "policy differences"--USA's trying to elevate their own policy opinions over those of the DoJ. Sorry, but that's most certainly grounds for dismissal from a political appointment, as Pat noted above. Heck, it's grounds for dismissal from almost any job. Go tell your boss you're going to follow your own policies and ignore his--after you check your cash reserves, of course. Once again, nothing is offered that indicates that any USA was dismissed for ignoring the guilty or persecuting the innocent.

Second link: Heavens! A Congressional staffer called a USA's office and asked about an ongoing vote-fraud investigation in that Congressman's district!. (Next thing you know, they'll be demanding crime statistics for their districts!) And then he had to answer questions about his job performance while interviewing for another political appointment! Will this outrageous political interference never end? The only things mentioned there that even approach impropriety are the Domenici and Wilson contacts with Iglesias, and those are pretty wide open to other (legitimate) interpretations, to say the least. Unless you're using the Red Queen standard of wing politics, of course.

Sorry, not going to comment on blog ramblings on wing sites. They're welcome to their opinions and to exercise their right of free speech, but it's not evidence of anything BUT their personal opinions, and their opinions I neither take seriously nor find credible. And they offer no evidence, just their own opinions. Their histrionics and attempts at stern gravitas do not lend weight to the allegations, just to thier ongoing and pre-established low opinion of the admin. (For more on these kinds of attempts to lend weight to such, see here.)

And given that these firings were discussed for two full years within the DoJ and the WH Counsel's office, it really really doesn't look like anyone was in any major hurry to disrupt any ongoing investigations.

There's just not any there there, unless you're using the Red Queen standard. (?No, no!? said the Queen. ?Sentence first?verdict afterward.?)

Referring to a centerist

Referring to a centerist (liberal) like Josh Marshall as a "wing" speaks volumes about the types of arguments you are willing to entertain. Referring to arguments from a side you disagree with a hysterical or angry or whatever (you've got to be kidding me--John Chait as an angry wignut?), and disregarding evidence you don't likeis a nice argumentative style, but it's not cutting here. And, calling attention to someone's questionable ways of trying to prove a point is not an ad hominem attack.

So, a member officials at Justice told Congress that the firings did not originate from the White House, and the aide in charge of the firings and his chief of staff resigns after documents requested in the investigation shows that the directive re: the firings did in fact originate in the White House, two of the prosecuters are alleging intimidation right before being fired, and the prosecutor in charge of the Cunningham case and investigations into CIA and Pentagon corruption is fired for failing to prosecute immigration violations (??!?)--all this coupled with the fact that firing 7 US Attorneys if in the middle of a term is completely unprecedent, and this doesn't raise any red flags for you?

Again, all I'm saying is that there is evidence to back up allegations made by these "wing" bloggers, and not that the allegations have been proven to any degree of certaint.

Josh Marshall is a centrist?

Josh Marshall is a centrist (or even a "centerist")? What the heck's the basis for that assertion? He's a good writer, a better-than-average liberal blogger, and I'm told a throughly pleasent chap - but "centrist" would surely suggest something about his policy views, not merely his comportment, writing ability and self-penned bio. What are his significant deviations from the liberal line (or, pace Brian, other centrist-qualifying credentials)?

Marshall is a liberal

Marshall is a liberal centrist (or, "centerist"--I may have to start using my typo intentionally now), meaning that he is consistently liberal, but hardly left wing, and certainly not a shrill blogger like other lefty bloggers who will remain nameless. Maybe "not shrill" is a better description--ie, he will make liberal arguments but they will be pretty honest and reasonable arguments and well within the mainstream of political discourse, and he shouldn't o be dismissed as a raving wingnut. It would be like a liberal calling Volokh Conspiracy or Dan Drezner wignut bloggers--to me, Volokh is pretty centrist, albeit conservative.

The above aren't analytically rigorous ideas, but I think the assertion that, while Marhall and Volokh have their ideological underpinnings, their commentary is generally pretty reasonable and middle of the road in terms of the spectrum of US political beliefs, is sound.

[OK, you guys win. It takes me about 5-10 tries to post a comment with that image verification thing, so I guess I'll register!]

Welcome aboard. ;)

I guess I'll register!

Welcome aboard. ;)

AHEM

Referring to arguments from a side you disagree with a hysterical or angry or whatever (you've got to be kidding me--John Chait as an angry wignut?), and disregarding evidence you don't likeis a nice argumentative style, but it's not cutting here. And, calling attention to someone's questionable ways of trying to prove a point is not an ad hominem attack.

It's not an "argumentative style" at all, it's dismissal of argument as NOT BEING EVIDENCE.

First off, neither of those links you offered contain ANY evidence of ANY wrongdoing. None. Zero. Zip. I requested evidence for your assertions, but you continue to not offer any. Hot air and conspiracy allegations are not evidence. They're innuendo and proclamation, of no evidentiary value outside of the bogus "New Anger" fallacy. You've been repeatedly asked to produce actual evidence, and you have produced none, just more and more talking-point allegations. When challenged on that, repeatedly, you argue side issues and still produce no evidence. See Da Rules. Second, you're accusing ME of ad hominem, yet you're the one committing it--and now you're committing it again. (And that's still giving you the benefit of the doubt on the Nazi linkage.)

We've been here before, Justin. It's downright patterned, and still reflects badly on you. Here, I'll make it simple. What actual (not imagined) available evidence do you think justifies your allegations of criminal or scandalous behavior in this affair? Put up or shut up. For the third and final time, be specific. Not linkages to articles or blogs by others, save as verifiable source reference for confirmation of specific evidentiary items offered here by you.

So, what "evidence?" Remember, not allegation nor innuendo nor proclamation, evidence that would incline a reasonable person with a working knowledge of politics to presumptively conclude that any actual wrongdoing may have occured. Actual evidence that can be produced in a court that would support an allegation of criminality to any minimal extent. Not someone else's UNSUPPORTED arguments via linkage. E-V-I-D-E-N-C-E. Here. From you.

Have you anything at all along those lines?

Our debates always end this

Our debates always end this way--you ask for evidence of something, whether its evidence that there is a consensus on global or warming, that the AP was not lying, or that US Attys' firing were politically motivated, I present evidence, and then you say it's not acutally evidence because it doesn't fit your pre-determind conclusions. Pretending to be "reasonable" and asking for evidence to support an assertion, and then disregarging such evidence, is a style of discourse that reflects rather poorly on you (countering your ad hominem attack). Documented instances of the administration misleading Congress on this issue, allegations made by prosecuters that they were pressured by the administration, and then fired, the forced resignation of a high profile US Attorney investigating powerful Republicans for questionable reasons, is all "evidence" (maybe you should look the word up in the dictionary).

Conclusions and allegations are not "evidence," Justin....

I'll chime in here since Tully is probably getting tired of sounding like a broken record.

Just now, you refer to "documented instances of the administration misleading Congress on this issue." That's a conclusion, not "evidence." What, specifically, do YOU think the administration mislead Congress on? What is the documentation for that? When you link to some news story with a whole bunch of claims and allegations by partisan critics, we have no way of knowing what in that morass you yourself consider to be "evidence," so we can't respond to your claims without addressing everything said in that article, which we're not going to waste our time doing.

Once you have actually presented what you, yourself, consider to be "evidence," then you can start accusing Tully of disregarding it. But as you yourself have presented no evidence beyond simply saying "read the Washington Post," then you have absolutely no basis for accusing Tully of disregarding anything. That, by the way, is your last and final warning about ad hominem attacks.

If you want to actually debate the issue, by marshalling evidence which you believe supports your point (i.e., "Attorney X said that" and "The e-mail showed that"), then you are welcome to do so. So far, you haven't. We run this blog to allow for actual debates over the issues, not to give a forum to folks to make ad hominem attacks against us because we demand that you actually support what you say and make clear what YOU (not the Washington Post) are saying.

When you link to some news

When you link to some news story with a whole bunch of claims and allegations by partisan critics, we have no way of knowing what in that morass you yourself consider to be "evidence," so we can't respond to your claims without addressing everything said in that article, which we're not going to waste our time doing.

You all have a very strange definition of the word evidence or are completely missing my point (sorry for not being clear). If the argument is that this a fake scandal and there is no evidence of wrongdoing or abuse of power, to counter that argument by briefly summarizing the evidence and linking to a newspaper article which shows that there is enough evidence to raise red flags seems reasonable. If I were asserting that the evidence is a slam dunk case, or that the allegations were true, that would be different.

If you want to actually debate the issue, by marshalling evidence which you believe supports your point (i.e., "Attorney X said that" and "The e-mail showed that"), then you are welcome to do so. So far, you haven't. We run this blog to allow for actual debates over the issues, not to give a forum to folks to make ad hominem attacks against us because we demand that you actually support what you say and make clear what YOU (not the Washington Post) are saying.

Point taken, although I disagree that linking to a Post article to make the point I'm trying to make isn't better than just summarizing points from various articles (and being accused of cherry-picking evidence).

Just now, you refer to "documented instances of the administration misleading Congress on this issue." That's a conclusion, not "evidence." What, specifically, do YOU think the administration mislead Congress on? What is the documentation for that?

One example:

Last week, senior Justice official William E. Moschella told a House Judiciary subcommittee that the White House was not consulted on the firings until the end of the process.

But the documents released this week show that the plan began more than two years ago at the White House counsel's office, which initially suggested firing all 93 U.S. attorneys. Gonzales rejected that idea, and Sampson wrote back in January 2006 that Justice and the White House should "work together to seek the replacement of a limited number of U.S. Attorneys."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/14/AR2007031400519.html

Is it safe to say that the verdict is still out on the merits of

the actual scandal, and the question that needs answering is whether actual illegal or unethical things were done (innocent people punished, guilty people let go), or it's just a case of politicians being politicians. If it's the latter, you roll your eyes, but that is the way the game is played, no?

"In the world you will find tribulation, but be of good cheer, for I have overcome the world."

John 16:33

Yep. The possibility of

Yep. The possibility of wrongdoing can't be excluded (negative proof) but without the showing of wrongdoing, it's all just allegation and innuendo, puffery and demagoguery. What, people are shocked that politics occurs in politics? Good heavens. Next they'll be telling me commerce occurs in markets, and violence happens in wars! Or that sex is somehow involved in reproduction.

See, that's a start....

[new comment thread started because of the indent level]

Now we can make some progress. You quote the Post as saying that the White House "initially suggested firing all 93 U.S. attorneys." Now I can go to the actual e-mail and look at what was actually said.

On Jan. 1, 2006, Kyle Sampson wrote to the White House Counsel, Harriet Meiers, saying "you asked whether President Bush should remove and replace the U.S. Attorneys whose four-year terms have expired." Asking a question is not always the same as making a suggestion. This may be a fine point, but it's an important one. Harriet Meiers could very well have said something like: "Kyle, I know that U.S. Attorneys serve for 4-year terms. Are we supposed to remove all of them at once? What's the past practice for that?" Sampson replied with a quite proper course of action.

[UPDATE: 1:48pm: Ok, gotta take that one back. A later e-mail (here, at page 32) has Sampson telling someone that Meiers had been "pushing" an across-the-board removal after 2004. Still, that's hardly improper and certainly not evidence of targeting individuals for being too lax on Democrats.]

You also quote the Post as reporting:

Last week, senior Justice official William E. Moschella told a House Judiciary subcommittee that the White House was not consulted on the firings until the end of the process.

This is used to support the charge that "the administration" mislead Congress.

Whether Moschella's testimony is a discrepancy from the truth will be determined, no doubt, by additional investigations. I can't find a transcript to find out exactly what he said. As a lawyer in a high-profile political job, I expect he chose his words very carefully. Only a fool would lie about something like this a week after the Scooter Libby verdict, and I doubt Moschella is that stupid. But let's look at the details, and see whether they support a change against "the administration".

MSNBC says that Moschella was "enraged" when he found out about the e-mails between Sampson and Meiers:

McNulty, Moschella and other Justice officials were enraged when they found out about the communications last Thursday, when Sampson produced the documents, according to officials who declined to speak for attribution in discussing internal Justice matters.

That's evidence that Moschella was not aware of the communications when he testified. "USDOJ" didn't mislead Congress, then, Sampson did, if anybody. And we don't know what questions Moschella asked Sampson before he went to testify, so it's possible that it was a misunderstanding. Washington's a big place, and the left hand often doesn't know what the right is doing.

Had the "administration" really been trying to mislead Congress, why in the world would they have released all these e-mails? These e-mails are easily subject to a claim of executive privilege and, in some cases, of attorney-client privilege. Yet "the administration" has released them within about a week of Moschella's testimony.

And was what Moschella said actually false? The word "consult" implies an exchange of views, something beyond mere "informing." So far, from the e-mails I've read, Meiers was never "consulted" about who to fire, she was merely informed about whose names the DOJ had decided should be put on the chopping block. There's no indication I've seen in the e-mails so far that Meiers or the White House ever weighed in with particular names, beyond Tim Griffin. And Bud Cummins, who Griffin replaced, was on the list which DOJ generated and sent to Meiers on March 2, 2005, recommended for replacement based on performance or refusal to support Administration policy, an entirely proper political reason for dismissal.

That March 2, 2005 list is very important. It was produced, so far as we know so far, entirely by DOJ as part of a wide-ranging end-of-term review. Of the 7 people removed from their position, DOJ was recommending the removal of 3 of them, Cummins, Lam, and Chiara, way back then.

Now, if you want to look for evidence of White House "interference" (which would not be improper, by the way), you might want to focus on David Iglesias of New Mexico and Kevin Ryan of California, whose names are bolded in the March 2 list, meaning that they are recommended for retaining.

I will grant that based on the facts presented in the MSNBC report, the conclusion that somebody was intentionally misleading Congress about the White House's involvement in the nomination of Griffin (but not the removal of Cummins) is a bit stronger. Sampson's email about "gumming" Griffin's interim appointment to death shows an intentional plan to mislead at least particular members of Congress about the administration's true intention with the length of his appointment. But that's a political misdeed, not a criminal one.

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